Discussion:
Does Mac Malware Benefit From Obscurity? No! Proved By Data.
(too old to reply)
Derek Currie
2006-06-08 19:00:33 UTC
Permalink
One of the stupid/favorite winTroll excuses for Windows having thousands
of times more malware than Mac is that the Mac is 'obscure.' They say
that Windows having around 90% market share versus Mac having around 4%
market share justifies their conjecture.

Below I perform some calculations to prove this conjecture to be
ridiculous. I challenge the winTrolls, or anyone with an actual brain in
their head, to come up with an actual explanation for the disparity in
malware. I toss out a few ideas myself.

On with the calculations. To be fair I have performed the calculations
twice to provide both a maximum and minimum result based upon the number
of malware reported at different websites.


1) The McAfee calculation.

This is based on the fact that McAfee quote the figure of 180,000+
malware at their website:
<http://vil.nai.com/vil/default.aspx>

Let me walk you through my calculations:

I created a proportion of the percent of the computer community on
Windows, versus the current percent on Mac, and the number of malware
for Windows versus the number of malware for Mac. I then calculated the
required factor to make this proportion work. For the percent of user
figures I used 90% on Windows and 4% on Mac. For malware I generously
used the figure of 55 pieces for Mac, which includes that available for
ye olde Mac OS as well as the 5 not-in-the-wild pieces of malware for
MOSX. For Windows malware I quoted the current McAfee published figure
of 180,000 pieces minus the 55 that are for Mac. The factor that makes
this proportion work is 145, which means that on a PER USER BASIS there
are 145x MORE malware for Windows than for Mac.

.90 180,000 - 55
X --- = ------------ where X = 145
.04 55


2) The Symantec calculation:

Now, let's do some work on behalf of the winTrolls and create the most
conservative version of this calculation possible. To do this I will use
the figure of 60,000 Internet security-related threats, as determined by
Symantec in their Security Response online database:
<http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/search.html>

.90 60,000 - 55
X --- = ------------ where X = 48
.04 55

There are 48x more malware, on a PER USER BASIS, for Windows than Mac.


If one wanted to compare the malware on each OS by removing the
'obscurity' factor, and if there were no other mitigating factors
involved in writing malware for one OS versus another, you should expect
the number of malware on a PER USER BASIS to be identical for both
operating systems. Clearly this is NOT the case.

Simple statistics proves there is zero validity to the obscurity
argument. IT IS DEAD.


3) What is the REAL explanation of dramatically fewer malware for Mac,
on a PER USER BASIS than for Windows?

I personally do not have the answer. I challenge everyone to brainstorm
their own explanations and post them.

Below are a few personal thoughts, for whatever they are worth:

1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.

2) Windows users hate their OS far more than Mac users, leading to
revenge by way of malware.

3) There is a more malicious culture of cracking among Windows users,
possibly related to #2.

4) There are a lot better tools and much better documentation about
how to crack Windows than there is for Mac.

5) The ability to crack Windows is much easier than Mac, allowing
less sophisticated crackers, such as 'script kiddies' to join in on
malware creation and evolution.


Readers: feel absolutely free to quote my calculations in any posts you
make. It is publicly available data, and anyone trained in algebra can
make the calculation if they WANT to. Obviously winTrolls want to avoid
this statistic at all costs in pursuit of the agenda of lies, ignorance
and FUD.

And yes, winTrolls. Expect me to pull these calculations out of
mothballs every time you perpetrate your 'obscurity' lie in the future.
And expect me to update these calculations to include the ever
increasing amount of malware for Windows as well as the all of the
relatively stagnant amount of malware for Mac OS X. I would appreciate
it if fellow Mac advocates would do so as well.


CONCLUSION: No matter what factors you consider, Windows has
dramatically more malware on a PER USER BASIS than Mac OS X. This means
that Mac OS X is remarkably more secure, in this case regarding malware,
than Windows. As has been quoted from even the CEO of McAfee, security
conscious computer users should be using Macintosh.
--
Fortune Magazine, 11-29-05: What's your computer setup today?
Frederick Brooks: I happily use a Macintosh. It's not been equalled for ease
of use, and I want my computer to be a tool, not a challenge.
<http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2005/12/12/8363107/>
[Frederick Brooks is the author of 'The Mythical Man Month'. He spearheaded
the movement to modernize computer software engineering in 1975]
Mike
2006-06-08 19:14:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Derek Currie
If one wanted to compare the malware on each OS by removing the
'obscurity' factor, and if there were no other mitigating factors
involved in writing malware for one OS versus another, you should expect
the number of malware on a PER USER BASIS to be identical for both
operating systems. Clearly this is NOT the case.
So, therefore, obscurity *is* a factor.

I don't know what point you were trying to make, but I doubt that was it!

Mike
George Graves
2006-06-08 20:20:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike
Post by Derek Currie
If one wanted to compare the malware on each OS by removing the
'obscurity' factor, and if there were no other mitigating factors
involved in writing malware for one OS versus another, you should expect
the number of malware on a PER USER BASIS to be identical for both
operating systems. Clearly this is NOT the case.
So, therefore, obscurity *is* a factor.
I don't know what point you were trying to make, but I doubt that was it!
Mike
You obvioulsy didn't read Derek's post with an eye to actually
understanding it, did you? If you had followed closely, you would have
noticed that it pretty much proves that obscurity is NOT a factor.
--
George Graves
The health of our society is a direct result of the men
and women we choose to admire.
Iconoclast
2006-06-08 22:17:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by George Graves
You obvioulsy didn't read Derek's post with an eye to actually
understanding it, did you? If you had followed closely, you would have
noticed that it pretty much proves that obscurity is NOT a factor.
Forget all the math. Forget that almost every government in the world uses
Unix based (like Mac OS) machines for servers and storing sensitive data.
Forget that Windows draws a much smaller line between user space and kernel
space. Forget that Internet Explorer has thousands more holes than Safari
(konqueror/firefox/opera/etc). Pretend that Windows and Mac both control
50% of the market. Windows would still have more malware based on one
aspect - sudo and/or the root account. On a default, non customized install
of Windows XP (home or pro, doesn't matter, I've used both) every user is
root. Every user, unless configured otherwise, can access any file, any
device, any program on the machine with no restrictions. This means any
program launched by that user can access everything too. In this aspect,
Mac OS isn't much better by default, but it at least makes you type your
password when you or one of your programs tries to access something that
only an administrator should have access to, system files and such. I think
most people will agree that most of the malware out there is installed by
the user, intentionally, by way of trojans from websites and emails
promising free porn, cute little kitten mouse cursors, and cracks or
keygens. The difference is, maybe a lot of Mac users will realize that
installing the cute little kitten cursors shouldn't require root
privileges, but the Windows user will blissfully install the trojan and not
even realize what they've done to themselves unless they went out and spent
$60 on McAffee. People will write more malware for Windows than they do for
Mac if they think Windows users are more likely to end up getting infected
by malware. Based on this alone, not including the thousands of other
reasons, security through obscurity is false microsoft propaganda bullshit.
If they fix this in Vista, write me back and I'll give you reason #2 why
Windows is a six foot high pile of shit and needs to be scrapped and
rewritten from scratch.
--
"Patriotism is supporting your country all the
time and your government when it deserves it." --Mark Twain
Mike
2006-06-09 00:57:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by George Graves
You obvioulsy didn't read Derek's post with an eye to actually
understanding it, did you? If you had followed closely, you would have
noticed that it pretty much proves that obscurity is NOT a factor.
No, it doesn't. It presents some opinions, but doesn't "prove" anything.

Mike
Ilgaz Öcal
2006-06-10 11:37:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike
Post by Derek Currie
If one wanted to compare the malware on each OS by removing the
'obscurity' factor, and if there were no other mitigating factors
involved in writing malware for one OS versus another, you should expect
the number of malware on a PER USER BASIS to be identical for both
operating systems. Clearly this is NOT the case.
So, therefore, obscurity *is* a factor.
I don't know what point you were trying to make, but I doubt that was it!
Mike
I am still horrified about malware on OS X (if it ever ships!) because
of false sense of trust in majority of (non geek,generic) mac users.

That is a very dangerous thing. It means a coder (pro or amateur) will
have zero defense targets if he codes anything actually works (pro or
amateur reasons).

Spyware authors are enjoying new boot camp users, a userbase who are
rich, never had actual spyware problem so the "paranoia" is minimum
levels. Apple should bundle at least Clam Win32 with Boot Camp. (it is
50 mb!). Note I am speaking about people used only Mac since 1985 and
just booted windows first time in their life with boot camp. It is very
hard to convince such a user that a system without firewall in win32
world can be auto hacked in 2 min by some robot, become zombie sending
thousands of spam.

I am speaking about that false security. Especially after OS X has
pirated/hacked Intel versions now everywhere. The "white hat" people I
know already tested it, if they test it, black hats will of course.

With that horrible EULA granting them everything, DivX networks enjoy
record breaking downloads on OS X for example. Not saying it DOES
something evil, it CAN do and you can't sue them with that license you
accepted. I even risked my VT paid account and told people to CHECK
that horrible EULA before installing. Result: 1 of 4 users found
helpful :) They may enjoy their .CC pinging codec, whatever.


Ilgaz
Lefty Bigfoot
2006-06-08 19:43:23 UTC
Permalink
Derek Currie wrote
(in article
<derekcurrie-***@syrcnyrdrs-01-
ge0.nyroc.rr.com>):


[snip a lot of relatively pointless algebra]
Post by Derek Currie
Readers: feel absolutely free to quote my calculations in any posts you
make. It is publicly available data, and anyone trained in algebra can
make the calculation if they WANT to. Obviously winTrolls want to avoid
this statistic at all costs in pursuit of the agenda of lies, ignorance
and FUD.
Except all of that work is of little value.
Post by Derek Currie
CONCLUSION: No matter what factors you consider, Windows has
dramatically more malware on a PER USER BASIS than Mac OS X.
And the problem with all of that is that you make the assumption
that malware is a factor due to a linear ratio as the number of
users increases. I haven't seen any evidence to suggest that
'per capita' numbers for something like this provides any useful
information whatsoever.

The real truth is that malware is essentially nonexistent, yet
not impossible under OS X, regardless of the reasons. Nothing
could be further from the truth for Windows.
Post by Derek Currie
This means that Mac OS X is remarkably more secure, in this case
regarding malware, than Windows.
That is true, regardless of the number of users. A platform's
security is either there or not there, even if only one person
uses it.
--
Lefty
All of God's creatures have a place..........
.........right next to the potatoes and gravy.
See also: Loading Image...
John Slade
2006-06-08 23:43:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lefty Bigfoot
(in article
[snip a lot of relatively pointless algebra]
Post by Derek Currie
Readers: feel absolutely free to quote my calculations in any posts you
make. It is publicly available data, and anyone trained in algebra can
make the calculation if they WANT to. Obviously winTrolls want to avoid
this statistic at all costs in pursuit of the agenda of lies, ignorance
and FUD.
Except all of that work is of little value.
Post by Derek Currie
CONCLUSION: No matter what factors you consider, Windows has
dramatically more malware on a PER USER BASIS than Mac OS X.
And the problem with all of that is that you make the assumption
that malware is a factor due to a linear ratio as the number of
users increases. I haven't seen any evidence to suggest that
'per capita' numbers for something like this provides any useful
information whatsoever.
The real truth is that malware is essentially nonexistent, yet
not impossible under OS X, regardless of the reasons. Nothing
could be further from the truth for Windows.
Post by Derek Currie
This means that Mac OS X is remarkably more secure, in this case
regarding malware, than Windows.
That is true, regardless of the number of users. A platform's
security is either there or not there, even if only one person
uses it.
I find a big clue in what malware actually does. A lot of it is to
distribute spam, ads and DOS attack software for distributed DOS attacks.
Now that right there says that the person sending the spam zombie software
would want to write it for a Mac. If they distribute it through spam, there
is a much greater chance the emails will wind up on a Windows box than an OS
X or Linux box.

John
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
Richard E Maine
2006-06-08 21:27:19 UTC
Permalink
Derek Currie <***@mac.com.invalid> wrote:
[aa bunch of arithmetic]
Post by Derek Currie
Readers: feel absolutely free to quote my calculations in any posts you
make. It is publicly available data, and anyone trained in algebra can
make the calculation if they WANT to.
Algebra? All I saw was arithmetic. I'd say that anyone trained in
algebra would wonder why you called this algebra. But in any case... you
aren't trained in mathematical proofs are you? (I am, by the way). There
is no "proof" of anything here. There are a bunch of unsupported
suppositions and some arithmetic. There is nothing to refute because
there is nothing here. It is a complete nonsequitur, dresssed up with
arithmetic.

There are names for some of the classic logical falacies in attempts at
proofs. But this one doesn't come up to the of those falacies.

By the way, no I am not at all a fan of Windows, I'm typing this on an
OS-X system at work, and my main home system is also OS X. Just because
I'm find of OS-X, that doesn't turn off my analytical abilities and make
me blindly swallow every argument that seems to be also supporting OS X.
Baseless arguments like yours hurt my position rather than help it.

Frankly, your use of the slur "winTroll" pretty much destroys any
argument right there. People with solid technical arguments don't need
to throw such slurs. I *DO* write technical papers for scientific
journals. In fact, several journals regularly send submitted papers to
me for my review. The use of terminology like that would in itself be
more than sufficient to reject a paper without a further look. If you
claim to have a "proof", you can present it in proper logical form
rather than with slurs.
--
Richard Maine | Good judgment comes from experience;
email: my first.last at org.domain| experience comes from bad judgment.
org: nasa, domain: gov | -- Mark Twain
William Mitchell
2006-06-08 23:25:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Richard E Maine
I *DO* write technical papers for scientific
journals. In fact, several journals regularly send submitted papers to
me for my review. The use of terminology like that would in itself be
more than sufficient to reject a paper without a further look. If you
claim to have a "proof", you can present it in proper logical form
rather than with slurs.
Perhaps I misunderstood. I didn't realize the original poster
regarded his submission as a submission to a technical journal.
--
Bill Mitchell
Dept of Mathematics, The University of Florida
PO Box 118105, Gainesville, FL 32611--8105
***@math.ufl.edu (352) 392-0281 x284
Richard Maine
2006-06-09 00:57:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Mitchell
Post by Richard E Maine
I *DO* write technical papers for scientific
journals. In fact, several journals regularly send submitted papers to
me for my review. The use of terminology like that would in itself be
more than sufficient to reject a paper without a further look. If you
claim to have a "proof", you can present it in proper logical form
rather than with slurs.
Perhaps I misunderstood. I didn't realize the original poster
regarded his submission as a submission to a technical journal.
He used and even emphasized the word "proof". That word implies actual
technical content... of the sort that technical journals take. That word
is what I was disagreeing with. Otherwise, I would not have bothered to
reply to that kind of drivel. (And I would not have even seen it if it
had been restricted to the advocacy groups instead of inappropriately
crossposted elsewhere).
--
Richard Maine | Good judgement comes from experience;
email: last name at domain . net | experience comes from bad judgement.
domain: summertriangle | -- Mark Twain
Mike
2006-06-09 01:04:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Mitchell
Perhaps I misunderstood. I didn't realize the original poster
regarded his submission as a submission to a technical journal.
Of course not. But he clearly believed he was "proving" something. But
he didn't prove anything.

Mike
John Slade
2006-06-08 23:39:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Derek Currie
One of the stupid/favorite winTroll excuses for Windows having thousands
of times more malware than Mac is that the Mac is 'obscure.' They say
that Windows having around 90% market share versus Mac having around 4%
market share justifies their conjecture.
Oh boy you left out a bunch of factors. In fact you left out the main
factor. The human factor. I say you should talk to hackers and you can get a
lot more information than you can crunching numbers. People who make viruses
and other malware want to spread it. People who want to use DDOS attacks
want to use as many computers as possible. It's common sense that they would
not want to even attack a Mac, Unix or Linux box.

John
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
Lars Träger
2006-06-12 23:40:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Slade
Post by Derek Currie
One of the stupid/favorite winTroll excuses for Windows having thousands
of times more malware than Mac is that the Mac is 'obscure.' They say
that Windows having around 90% market share versus Mac having around 4%
market share justifies their conjecture.
Oh boy you left out a bunch of factors. In fact you left out the main
factor. The human factor. I say you should talk to hackers and you can get a
lot more information than you can crunching numbers. People who make viruses
and other malware want to spread it. People who want to use DDOS attacks
want to use as many computers as possible. It's common sense that they would
not want to even attack a Mac, Unix or Linux box.
So you admit it's easier to fool PC users.
--
Lars T.
NRen2k5
2006-06-14 06:25:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lars Träger
Post by John Slade
Post by Derek Currie
One of the stupid/favorite winTroll excuses for Windows having thousands
of times more malware than Mac is that the Mac is 'obscure.' They say
that Windows having around 90% market share versus Mac having around 4%
market share justifies their conjecture.
Oh boy you left out a bunch of factors. In fact you left out the main
factor. The human factor. I say you should talk to hackers and you can get a
lot more information than you can crunching numbers. People who make viruses
and other malware want to spread it. People who want to use DDOS attacks
want to use as many computers as possible. It's common sense that they would
not want to even attack a Mac, Unix or Linux box.
So you admit it's easier to fool PC users.
It's easy to fool the average joe. And the average joe uses a PC like
(almost) everybody else.
--
http://pcguyelevated.ytmnd.com/
Derek Currie
2006-06-23 07:09:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by NRen2k5
It's easy to fool the average joe. And the average joe uses a PC like
(almost) everybody else.
Agreed. I just replied to John Slade regarding that subject. To quote
Post by NRen2k5
Any
virus spreader would find the group that would most likely install anything
if it will let them get free software or porno. That's usually kids and
pervs.
Yes. This is the ongoing development of 'Social Engineering' in malware
propagation. Most definitely Mac users are just as susceptible to
downloading and installing this crap as Windows users. Due to the
internal security in Mac OS X it is much more difficult for such malware
to do damage and spread itself than is possible on Windows. But there
are ways and means if a Mac user is not security savvy.
Therefore, one of my goals is to enlighten Mac users about being
security savvy.

The other goal of course is to frustrate the Mac security FUD mongers
and wintrolls.


*** I have decided to create a regular post regarding the subject of why
malware on Windows is dramatically higher, ON A PER USER BASIS, than on
Mac. I will be researching facts, tossing explanations on the table and
let folks chat about it. The first post in the series will feature
WebAttacker, the DIY kit for Windows users that let's them build their
own spyware. Shocking sh*t.


:-D
--
Fortune Magazine, 11-29-05: What's your computer setup today?
Frederick Brooks: I happily use a Macintosh. It's not been equalled for ease
of use, and I want my computer to be a tool, not a challenge.
<http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2005/12/12/8363107/>
[Frederick Brooks is the author of 'The Mythical Man Month'. He spearheaded
the movement to modernize computer software engineering in 1975]
NRen2k5
2006-06-08 23:54:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Derek Currie
One of the stupid/favorite winTroll excuses for Windows having thousands
of times more malware than Mac is that the Mac is 'obscure.' They say
that Windows having around 90% market share versus Mac having around 4%
market share justifies their conjecture.
Below I perform some calculations to prove this conjecture to be
ridiculous. I challenge the winTrolls, or anyone with an actual brain in
their head, to come up with an actual explanation for the disparity in
malware. I toss out a few ideas myself.
On with the calculations. To be fair I have performed the calculations
twice to provide both a maximum and minimum result based upon the number
of malware reported at different websites.
1) The McAfee calculation.
This is based on the fact that McAfee quote the figure of 180,000+
<http://vil.nai.com/vil/default.aspx>
I created a proportion of the percent of the computer community on
Windows, versus the current percent on Mac, and the number of malware
for Windows versus the number of malware for Mac. I then calculated the
required factor to make this proportion work. For the percent of user
figures I used 90% on Windows and 4% on Mac. For malware I generously
used the figure of 55 pieces for Mac, which includes that available for
ye olde Mac OS as well as the 5 not-in-the-wild pieces of malware for
MOSX. For Windows malware I quoted the current McAfee published figure
of 180,000 pieces minus the 55 that are for Mac. The factor that makes
this proportion work is 145, which means that on a PER USER BASIS there
are 145x MORE malware for Windows than for Mac.
.90 180,000 - 55
X --- = ------------ where X = 145
.04 55
Now, let's do some work on behalf of the winTrolls and create the most
conservative version of this calculation possible. To do this I will use
the figure of 60,000 Internet security-related threats, as determined by
<http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/search.html>
.90 60,000 - 55
X --- = ------------ where X = 48
.04 55
There are 48x more malware, on a PER USER BASIS, for Windows than Mac.
If one wanted to compare the malware on each OS by removing the
'obscurity' factor, and if there were no other mitigating factors
involved in writing malware for one OS versus another, you should expect
the number of malware on a PER USER BASIS to be identical for both
operating systems. Clearly this is NOT the case.
Simple statistics proves there is zero validity to the obscurity
argument. IT IS DEAD.
Wrong. Simple statistics prove nothing. Because they are nothing but
simple statistics. There is no proof of causality.
Post by Derek Currie
3) What is the REAL explanation of dramatically fewer malware for Mac,
on a PER USER BASIS than for Windows?
I personally do not have the answer. I challenge everyone to brainstorm
their own explanations and post them.
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
Out of the box, yes. Properly secured, no.
Post by Derek Currie
2) Windows users hate their OS far more than Mac users, leading to
revenge by way of malware.
True.
Post by Derek Currie
3) There is a more malicious culture of cracking among Windows users,
possibly related to #2.
True.
Post by Derek Currie
4) There are a lot better tools and much better documentation about
how to crack Windows than there is for Mac.
True.
Post by Derek Currie
5) The ability to crack Windows is much easier than Mac, allowing
less sophisticated crackers, such as 'script kiddies' to join in on
malware creation and evolution.
Not true. "Easier" is in the mind of the cracker. An experienced Mac
user will know how to take advantage of a Mac much the same as an
experienced PC user can with a PC.
Post by Derek Currie
Readers: feel absolutely free to quote my calculations in any posts you
make. It is publicly available data, and anyone trained in algebra can
make the calculation if they WANT to. Obviously winTrolls want to avoid
this statistic at all costs in pursuit of the agenda of lies, ignorance
and FUD.
Feel free indeed. Taking such a narrow point of view makes you
incredibly easy to rebuke.
Post by Derek Currie
And yes, winTrolls. Expect me to pull these calculations out of
mothballs every time you perpetrate your 'obscurity' lie in the future.
Oh, getting vicious now, are we? Mislabeling someone's point of view as
an outright lie, now.
Post by Derek Currie
And expect me to update these calculations to include the ever
increasing amount of malware for Windows as well as the all of the
relatively stagnant amount of malware for Mac OS X. I would appreciate
it if fellow Mac advocates would do so as well.
Of course you would. Good luck.
Post by Derek Currie
CONCLUSION: No matter what factors you consider, Windows has
dramatically more malware on a PER USER BASIS than Mac OS X. This means
that Mac OS X is remarkably more secure, in this case regarding malware,
than Windows. As has been quoted from even the CEO of McAfee, security
conscious computer users should be using Macintosh.
Security conscious users should not be connected to the internet, period.

Windows is less secure out-of-the-box than MacOS, granted, but it is
more secure when properly patched and with the right software.

This is thanks to the simple reason that Windows is always under attack
and we know what needs to be protected. You and your Macs? You're just
content with not being attacked.

- NRen2k5
Josh McKee
2006-06-09 20:41:49 UTC
Permalink
In article
<derekcurrie-***@syrcnyrdrs-01-ge0.nyroc.rr.com>,
Derek Currie <***@mac.com.invalid> wrote:

[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?

Josh
GreyCloud
2006-06-09 22:41:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
--
Where are we going?
And why am I in this handbasket?
Josh McKee
2006-06-09 22:57:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.

Josh
GreyCloud
2006-06-10 04:32:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.
I don't know of any vendors currently selling Windows on MIPS.
There are no Windows on Alphas anymore. And on the Alphas, windows NT
could not compete against Tru-64 UNIX or OpenVMS for Alphas.

So the answer is no malware as there are no windows on both of said
platforms.
--
Where are we going?
And why am I in this handbasket?
Josh McKee
2006-06-10 15:06:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.
I don't know of any vendors currently selling Windows on MIPS.
There are no Windows on Alphas anymore. And on the Alphas, windows NT could not compete
against Tru-64 UNIX or OpenVMS for Alphas.
Irrelevant.
Post by GreyCloud
So the answer is no malware as there are no windows on both of said
platforms.
Are you saying that there is none? None at all? None for an OS you claim
is so weak in security? How can this be?

Josh
GreyCloud
2006-06-10 18:17:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.
I don't know of any vendors currently selling Windows on MIPS.
There are no Windows on Alphas anymore. And on the Alphas, windows NT could not compete
against Tru-64 UNIX or OpenVMS for Alphas.
Irrelevant.
Post by GreyCloud
So the answer is no malware as there are no windows on both of said
platforms.
Are you saying that there is none? None at all? None for an OS you claim
is so weak in security? How can this be?
Because they don't exist. I notice your squirming and twisting in the
wind makes it a bit hard to piss on ya.
--
Where are we going?
And why am I in this handbasket?
Josh McKee
2006-06-10 18:32:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.
I don't know of any vendors currently selling Windows on MIPS.
There are no Windows on Alphas anymore. And on the Alphas, windows NT could not compete
against Tru-64 UNIX or OpenVMS for Alphas.
Irrelevant.
Post by GreyCloud
So the answer is no malware as there are no windows on both of said
platforms.
Are you saying that there is none? None at all? None for an OS you claim
is so weak in security? How can this be?
Because they don't exist.
Why not? You do know that we're talking about Windows...right?

Josh
GreyCloud
2006-06-11 02:26:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.
I don't know of any vendors currently selling Windows on MIPS.
There are no Windows on Alphas anymore. And on the Alphas, windows NT could not compete
against Tru-64 UNIX or OpenVMS for Alphas.
Irrelevant.
Post by GreyCloud
So the answer is no malware as there are no windows on both of said
platforms.
Are you saying that there is none? None at all? None for an OS you claim
is so weak in security? How can this be?
Because they don't exist.
Why not? You do know that we're talking about Windows...right?
Yes, we're talking about windows. Now go find a current vendor of Mips
or Alpha that sells windows on these.
Your strawmans argument is a bit obvious.
--
Where are we going?
And why am I in this handbasket?
Josh McKee
2006-06-11 13:17:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.
I don't know of any vendors currently selling Windows on MIPS.
There are no Windows on Alphas anymore. And on the Alphas, windows NT
could
not compete
against Tru-64 UNIX or OpenVMS for Alphas.
Irrelevant.
Post by GreyCloud
So the answer is no malware as there are no windows on both of said
platforms.
Are you saying that there is none? None at all? None for an OS you claim
is so weak in security? How can this be?
Because they don't exist.
Why not? You do know that we're talking about Windows...right?
Yes, we're talking about windows.
Then why can't you name a single piece of malware? Weren't you
championing the notion of how insecure windows is? Using > 100K pieces
of malware to support your assertion? Now you can't even give a single
example. Therefore, applying your "logic" Windows is just as secure as
OS X. Is this really what you're trying to say?

Josh
GreyCloud
2006-06-12 04:11:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.
I don't know of any vendors currently selling Windows on MIPS.
There are no Windows on Alphas anymore. And on the Alphas, windows NT
could
not compete
against Tru-64 UNIX or OpenVMS for Alphas.
Irrelevant.
Post by GreyCloud
So the answer is no malware as there are no windows on both of said
platforms.
Are you saying that there is none? None at all? None for an OS you claim
is so weak in security? How can this be?
Because they don't exist.
Why not? You do know that we're talking about Windows...right?
Yes, we're talking about windows.
Then why can't you name a single piece of malware? Weren't you
championing the notion of how insecure windows is? Using > 100K pieces
of malware to support your assertion? Now you can't even give a single
example. Therefore, applying your "logic" Windows is just as secure as
OS X. Is this really what you're trying to say?
For windows malware:
http://www.microsoft.com/security/malwareremove/default.mspx

Looks pretty insecure to me.
And M$ admits it and has software for removal of said non-existent malware.

Guffaw!!!
--
Where are we going?
And why am I in this handbasket?
Josh McKee
2006-06-12 23:01:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.
I don't know of any vendors currently selling Windows on MIPS.
There are no Windows on Alphas anymore. And on the Alphas, windows NT
could
not compete
against Tru-64 UNIX or OpenVMS for Alphas.
Irrelevant.
Post by GreyCloud
So the answer is no malware as there are no windows on both of said
platforms.
Are you saying that there is none? None at all? None for an OS you claim
is so weak in security? How can this be?
Because they don't exist.
Why not? You do know that we're talking about Windows...right?
Yes, we're talking about windows.
Then why can't you name a single piece of malware? Weren't you
championing the notion of how insecure windows is? Using > 100K pieces
of malware to support your assertion? Now you can't even give a single
example. Therefore, applying your "logic" Windows is just as secure as
OS X. Is this really what you're trying to say?
http://www.microsoft.com/security/malwareremove/default.mspx
Looks pretty insecure to me.
Which doesn't apply to Windows on MIPS or Alpha.
Post by GreyCloud
And M$ admits it and has software for removal of said non-existent malware.
But you said:

"Because they don't exist."

Are you now saying that they do exist?

Josh
Lars Träger
2006-06-13 00:26:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
http://www.microsoft.com/security/malwareremove/default.mspx
Looks pretty insecure to me.
Which doesn't apply to Windows on MIPS or Alpha.
Post by GreyCloud
And M$ admits it and has software for removal of said non-existent malware.
"Because they don't exist."
Are you now saying that they do exist?
Ahh, so you say that there is no malware for Windows on MIPS or Alpha
because Microsoft hasn't made removal tools for them.
--
Lars T.
Josh McKee
2006-06-13 00:55:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lars Träger
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
http://www.microsoft.com/security/malwareremove/default.mspx
Looks pretty insecure to me.
Which doesn't apply to Windows on MIPS or Alpha.
Post by GreyCloud
And M$ admits it and has software for removal of said non-existent malware.
"Because they don't exist."
Are you now saying that they do exist?
Ahh, so you say that there is no malware for Windows on MIPS or Alpha
because Microsoft hasn't made removal tools for them.
I said no such thing.

Josh
GreyCloud
2006-06-13 18:54:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.
I don't know of any vendors currently selling Windows on MIPS.
There are no Windows on Alphas anymore. And on the Alphas, windows NT
could
not compete
against Tru-64 UNIX or OpenVMS for Alphas.
Irrelevant.
Post by GreyCloud
So the answer is no malware as there are no windows on both of said
platforms.
Are you saying that there is none? None at all? None for an OS you claim
is so weak in security? How can this be?
Because they don't exist.
Why not? You do know that we're talking about Windows...right?
Yes, we're talking about windows.
Then why can't you name a single piece of malware? Weren't you
championing the notion of how insecure windows is? Using > 100K pieces
of malware to support your assertion? Now you can't even give a single
example. Therefore, applying your "logic" Windows is just as secure as
OS X. Is this really what you're trying to say?
http://www.microsoft.com/security/malwareremove/default.mspx
Looks pretty insecure to me.
Which doesn't apply to Windows on MIPS or Alpha.
No one runs MIPS or Alpha with windows. NT can compete against IRIX,
Tru-64 UNIX, or OpenVMS. NT was dropped.
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
And M$ admits it and has software for removal of said non-existent malware.
"Because they don't exist."
Are you now saying that they do exist?
Reading comprehension problems again, Josh?
Taken out of context as usual for wintrolls.
--
Where are we going?
And why am I in this handbasket?
Josh McKee
2006-06-13 21:39:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than
Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.
I don't know of any vendors currently selling Windows on MIPS.
There are no Windows on Alphas anymore. And on the Alphas, windows NT
could
not compete
against Tru-64 UNIX or OpenVMS for Alphas.
Irrelevant.
Post by GreyCloud
So the answer is no malware as there are no windows on both of said
platforms.
Are you saying that there is none? None at all? None for an OS you claim
is so weak in security? How can this be?
Because they don't exist.
Why not? You do know that we're talking about Windows...right?
Yes, we're talking about windows.
Then why can't you name a single piece of malware? Weren't you
championing the notion of how insecure windows is? Using > 100K pieces
of malware to support your assertion? Now you can't even give a single
example. Therefore, applying your "logic" Windows is just as secure as
OS X. Is this really what you're trying to say?
http://www.microsoft.com/security/malwareremove/default.mspx
Looks pretty insecure to me.
Which doesn't apply to Windows on MIPS or Alpha.
No one runs MIPS or Alpha with windows.
So you're saying it's a market share thing? Thanks for finally waking up
to reality!

Josh
GreyCloud
2006-06-14 05:01:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than
Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
Most likely that the hacker could recompile their viruses/malware for
those platforms and the same results would happen.
I didn't ask if it could be recompiled. I asked how much currently
exists. Still waiting for an answer.
I don't know of any vendors currently selling Windows on MIPS.
There are no Windows on Alphas anymore. And on the Alphas, windows NT
could
not compete
against Tru-64 UNIX or OpenVMS for Alphas.
Irrelevant.
Post by GreyCloud
So the answer is no malware as there are no windows on both of said
platforms.
Are you saying that there is none? None at all? None for an OS you claim
is so weak in security? How can this be?
Because they don't exist.
Why not? You do know that we're talking about Windows...right?
Yes, we're talking about windows.
Then why can't you name a single piece of malware? Weren't you
championing the notion of how insecure windows is? Using > 100K pieces
of malware to support your assertion? Now you can't even give a single
example. Therefore, applying your "logic" Windows is just as secure as
OS X. Is this really what you're trying to say?
http://www.microsoft.com/security/malwareremove/default.mspx
Looks pretty insecure to me.
Which doesn't apply to Windows on MIPS or Alpha.
No one runs MIPS or Alpha with windows.
So you're saying it's a market share thing? Thanks for finally waking up
to reality!
Being clueless won't get you off the hook so easily.
No one sells MIPS or Alphas with windows on them.
So much for your strawmans argument.
--
Where are we going?
And why am I in this handbasket?
sav
2006-06-15 00:29:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Josh McKee
Post by GreyCloud
No one runs MIPS or Alpha with windows.
So you're saying it's a market share thing? Thanks for finally waking up
to reality!
Josh
That's the funniest market share argument I have ever seen.
Randy Howard
2006-06-10 04:43:44 UTC
Permalink
Josh McKee wrote
(in article
Post by Josh McKee
In article
[ snip ]
Post by Derek Currie
1) Windows is really is a far less secure operating system than Mac.
How much malware exists for Windows on the MIPS platform? The Alpha
platform?
I've had access to a single Alpha/Windows system, and that was a
LONG time ago. I've never seen a MIPS box running Windows. I
suspect that you couldn't find one if you wanted to. You might
as well ask how much malware exists for the Altair.

Its far more likely to be available for you to try out.
--
Randy Howard (2reply remove FOOBAR)
"The power of accurate observation is called cynicism by those
who have not got it." - George Bernard Shaw
jemmy
2006-06-25 22:40:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Derek Currie
CONCLUSION: No matter what factors you consider, Windows has
dramatically more malware on a PER USER BASIS than Mac OS X. This means
that Mac OS X is remarkably more secure, in this case regarding
malware, than Windows. As has been quoted from even the CEO of McAfee,
security conscious computer users should be using Macintosh.
Sorry to post so late, but I just have to point out that your argument
is really stupid.

The fact that there is no linear relation between market share and
malware per user demonstrates nothing since there is no reason to
suppose that the proportion of dick heads who write malware should
necessarily follow market share; indeed, it makes far more sense to
assume _all_ such dick heads would write malware for the platform with
the single largest marketshare. This is the same reason why all bra
manufacturers aim their marketing efforts at women: despite the fact
that there are some male cross dressers who wear bras, you will not
find that 1% of all bra advertisements are directed at men.

If Macs had a 90% marketshare, then all malware would be written for
Macs. If marketshare numbers where close to 50/50, then your approach
would have some merit.
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
Derek Currie
2006-06-29 02:18:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by jemmy
Sorry to post so late, but I just have to point out that your argument
is really stupid.
The fact that there is no linear relation between market share and
malware per user demonstrates nothing since there is no reason to
suppose that the proportion of dick heads who write malware should
necessarily follow market share;
Excuse me, but you just proved my point!!! You are quite right! The
idiotic myth that I busted is insisting that there IS "reason to suppose
that the proportion of dick heads who write malware should necessarily
follow market share." DING! BINGO! Get it?!
Post by jemmy
indeed, it makes far more sense to
assume _all_ such dick heads would write malware for the platform with
the single largest marketshare.
Really? Based on what data? 'Assume' makes an 'ass' out of 'you' and
'me'. Lame, I know. But you need to justify this. Please do. It would
explain things.
Post by jemmy
This is the same reason why all bra
HAHAHAHAHAHA! I am afraid to read on!
Post by jemmy
despite the fact
that there are some male cross dressers who wear bras, you will not
find that 1% of all bra advertisements are directed at men.
OMG! You have to be f*cking kidding! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! OK
stop or I'll wet my shorts.
Post by jemmy
If Macs had a 90% marketshare, then all malware would be written for
Macs. If marketshare numbers where close to 50/50, then your approach
would have some merit.
Again, based on what facts? I can prove my point with data, as stated in
the title (albeit a stupid title) of this thread.

I think we can at least agree that, for some reason or other, dickhead
malware writers have it in for Windows at an extremely disproportionate
level compared to their malware writing for Mac.

What I challenge folks to do is to explain why this exists.

The ultra-stupid myth that the 'obscurity' of Mac OS X is the reason why
it has only 5 pieces of malware (55 malware in the entire history of the
Mac) has been destroyed once and for all. It was never true. It has zero
justification. Anyone making that argument is ignorant. A better
explanation is required. Make it please.

I have been busy this week, but forthcoming sometime soon will be a few
possible explanations I have dug up on the net. They won't be
definitive, but they will be worth consideration. The 'obscurity' myth
is NOT worth consideration.

:-D
--
Fortune Magazine, 11-29-05: What's your computer setup today?
Frederick Brooks: I happily use a Macintosh. It's not been equalled for ease
of use, and I want my computer to be a tool, not a challenge.
<http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2005/12/12/8363107/>
[Frederick Brooks is the author of 'The Mythical Man Month'. He spearheaded
the movement to modernize computer software engineering in 1975]
jemmy
2006-07-02 16:53:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Derek Currie
Post by jemmy
Sorry to post so late, but I just have to point out that your argument
is really stupid.
The fact that there is no linear relation between market share and
malware per user demonstrates nothing since there is no reason to
suppose that the proportion of dick heads who write malware should
necessarily follow market share;
Excuse me, but you just proved my point!!! You are quite right! The
idiotic myth that I busted is insisting that there IS "reason to
suppose that the proportion of dick heads who write malware should
necessarily follow market share." DING! BINGO! Get it?!
No, I didn't prove your point, as you noticed below. This is why you
should read the whole thing before imagining that you know what's
coming. It's also why you should have edited out the above comment: it
only makes you look bad.
Post by Derek Currie
Post by jemmy
indeed, it makes far more sense to assume _all_ such dick heads would
write malware for the platform with the single largest marketshare.
Really? Based on what data? 'Assume' makes an 'ass' out of 'you' and
'me'. Lame, I know. But you need to justify this. Please do. It would
explain things.
If your object is to infect the maximum number of machines with the
minimum effort, you go after the platform with the largest market
share. All malware writers can be expected to follow this same course.
I thought I was pretty clear about this the first time. This is the
problem with your whole argument.
Post by Derek Currie
Post by jemmy
This is the same reason why all bra manufacturers aim their marketing
HAHAHAHAHAHA! I am afraid to read on!
Post by jemmy
despite the fact that there are some male cross dressers who wear bras,
you will not find that 1% of all bra advertisements are directed at men.
OMG! You have to be f*cking kidding! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! OK
stop or I'll wet my shorts.
I'm glad you enjoyed it--it was, after all, meant to be funny.
Post by Derek Currie
Post by jemmy
If Macs had a 90% marketshare, then all malware would be written for
Macs. If marketshare numbers where close to 50/50, then your approach
would have some merit.
Again, based on what facts? I can prove my point with data, as stated
in the title (albeit a stupid title) of this thread.
Obviously I cannot provide "data" for that specific supposition because
Macs simply do not have 90% market share. However, you have no "data"
that actually supports your conclusion. You have a bunch of numbers,
but you don't know what to do with them. Your "data" is neither here
nor there because your theoretical model is absurd.

It's rather like arguing that the sky is usually orange and green
because 2+2=4. No one would deny your "data" (2+2=4), but your
conclusion is dubious. What's more, the connection between the
conclusion you want to make and your data is absurd. There is
absolutely no reason to suppose that platform-specific malware should
be proportionate to platform market share, just as there is no reason
to suppose simple arithmetic facts should affect the color of the sky.

I would point out that there are no viruses for my CP/M Kaypro 2 or
Apple IIe. Should I expect 0.0001% of all viruses and trojans to be
written for those computers?
Post by Derek Currie
I think we can at least agree that, for some reason or other, dickhead
malware writers have it in for Windows at an extremely disproportionate
level compared to their malware writing for Mac.
What I challenge folks to do is to explain why this exists.
I already did. It comes down to economy of effort on the part of
malware authors--bang for the 'buck,' if you will.

Your argument amounts to a waste of your time. If you want to argue
that a properly maintained Mac is more secure than a properly
maintained PC, then do so. Don't rely on doubtful statistical
arguments with flawed null hypotheses.

For my part, I really couldn't give a damn. I only commented here to
point out that your argument was stupid--not to take a contrary
position to the one you seem to want to take.
Post by Derek Currie
The ultra-stupid myth that the 'obscurity' of Mac OS X is the reason
why it has only 5 pieces of malware (55 malware in the entire history
of the Mac) has been destroyed once and for all. It was never true. It
has zero justification. Anyone making that argument is ignorant. A
better explanation is required. Make it please.
I have been busy this week, but forthcoming sometime soon will be a few
possible explanations I have dug up on the net. They won't be
definitive, but they will be worth consideration. The 'obscurity' myth
is NOT worth consideration.
:-D
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
Loading...